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The latest from Indonesia:
Communication and Information Minister Tifatul Sembiring said that there were many television programmes that destroyed morals.
Therefore, the minister said, natural disasters would continue to occur.
His comments came as he addressed a prayer meeting on Friday in Padang, Sumatra, which was hit by a powerful earthquake in late September.
He also hit out at rising decadence - proven, he said, by the availability of Indonesia-made pornographic DVDs in local markets - and called for tougher laws.
posted by LAGuy @ 12:31 AM
9 Comments:
How about this statement, made last week. "When societies accept, condone and embrace sin, they are judged."
That's from a Christian. See http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=116837
Its amazing how these all-knowing all-seeing entities are capable of deploying horrible natural forces for less than scrutable reasons.
I think it is Job that you are trying to reference. Yes God is unsearchable, inscrutable. And yes it is amazing. Probably it would be more positively amazing to anon2 if he looked at it from a traditional religious view. In this view, God's mercy is holding back the natural consequences of sin (the immediate destruction of the universe).
Hmm, hadn't heard that one before. Why would the immediate destruction of the universe be the natural consequence of sin? Isn't that what hell is for?
(Insert snarky remark about evidence of earthquakes that predated porn.)
So Anon3 thinks that by his destructive inexplicable acts, we shall know him.
Kind of Nixonian- "I'm a Mad Man! So you better watch out!"
QG,
You have to start from the premise that there is no reason anything in our realm of understanding had to exist at all. The creator strove to create something to His liking. It came out rather badly, but having given it existence, He has resisted the inclination that any dissatisfied creator would have to crunch up and dispose of this apparent failure. There have been human societies (Sparta) that had this attitude - imperfect babies destroyed immediately upon dioscovery (if "300" is to be believed ;)
So Christian philosophy (and maybe Jewish and Muslim philosophy) is that it is only by an act of extreme Grace that we are permitted to continue existing at all. Especially since it seems there is some sort of cosmic price that muct be paid for the imperfection (sin) to keep things in balance. God has not only gracefully allowed existence to continue (and evolve?), he has paid the price or penalty to necessary to do so.
That's the philosophy, anyway.
"You have to start from the premise that there is no reason anything in our realm of understanding had to exist at all."
I assume you mean we have to assume this for the argument, not that it makes the slightest lick of sense.
"The creator strove to create something to His liking. It came out rather badly,"
Which has some pretty odd implications.
"but having given it existence, He has resisted the inclination that any dissatisfied creator would have to crunch up and dispose of this apparent failure."
So it's sort of like serving at the President's pleasure. The assumption is since you'll never do your job perfectly he should be firing you at all times, but only due to his goodness does he let you keep your job.
"There have been human societies (Sparta) that had this attitude - imperfect babies destroyed immediately upon dioscovery (if "300" is to be believed ;)"
It was common in many old societies, where life was hard and starvation and war weren't far away, not to raise children who didn't have much of a chance.
Another thing many old societies believed was if there was corruption or sin allowed by its people, the whose society would be corrupted. That's the plot of "Oedipus" for example.
"So Christian philosophy (and maybe Jewish and Muslim philosophy) is that it is only by an act of extreme Grace that we are permitted to continue existing at all."
This was why Ayn Rand hated religion. It starts with the assumption you're worthless, that anything you achieve isn't enough, and that creating your own joy and value is wrong.
"Especially since it seems there is some sort of cosmic price that muct be paid for the imperfection (sin) to keep things in balance."
So the creator has no say in this system? It's just a feature--or defect--that he can't remove. Because there's nothing in logic that demands things work this way. (Though I can see how humans, with their sense of morality, and power, can insist in forcing an overlay of this concept onto their view of the world.)
"God has not only gracefully allowed existence to continue (and evolve?), he has paid the price or penalty to necessary to do so.
That's the philosophy, anyway."
What do you think of it?
I'm a Christian. The philosophy answers a lot of questions for me (though only by faith - readily admittheir is no way to prove its truth). It allows me to avoid pridefulness, and also embrace striving to be good. I became a Christian later in life (age 29 or so) and while I felt compelled to be moral, I couldn't find a really compelling logical reason to be so (beyond fear of getting caught doing evil, of course, and paying the consequence). The belief that humans are a special creation, very flawed, but capable of becoming much better, gives me contentment and at the same time drives me to ever try to do better. Its a complex coordination between feeling unworthy, and therefore grateful for my blessings, yet knowing I am intended for great things so trying to be more worthy and expecting these great things to be realized in the future (or another reality).
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