Denver Pile
I'm not seeing too much of this yet (and by the time I get around to something it's old news), but isn't our own DenverGuy clearly right?
I doubt only his statement that Obama wouldn't take Hillary as VP; more likely, Hillary won't take VP. Of course, anyone who put his heartbeat between a Clinton and the White House would be a fool, so I hedge and say DG may be right. Still, apart from that, I don't believe these people have any principles that would stop the Big O 2 from taking Hill as his No. 2, not even hatred.
Apart from that,though, under the circumstances, isn't Obama really just fighting to be VP? And why shouldn't he? As far as the NYTimes and the broadcast networks would be concerned, such a ticket would be impregnable. Either candidate who gave up the shot at this point would be a fool.
posted by ColumbusGuy @ 6:07 AM
7 Comments:
I'm not sure. If Hillary were in the lead and Obama fighting to stay in the race, I think he'd snap up the VP job in a heartbeat. But it's the other way around.
If he reaches the convention with a majority of delegates and the supers swing the nomination to Hillary, he might just say "Screw you all" and go back home.
Of course, in the back room of all the back rooms, there might be some serious arm-twisting (Look, you do this for us now and we'll take care of you when the time comes) and who knows? Right now, I'm thinking it might be the Dems best shot.
Obama as VP candidate is not the same as Obama as #1 candidate. While it is fashionable to think of charismatic leaders as all-powerful over their flocks, they must react to the expectations of the movement they created/inspired. (would Johnson/Kennedy have won in 1960?)
Forget the fact that he's ahead in states and delegates and the presumptive nominee to everyone except Clintonites and the other party's boosters, if Obama abandons his "new politics" approach and agrees to join the what his people believe to be a junior partner in the failed and tired politics of the past(think of what was done to Al Gore), he ceases to be Obama. While some support would come to the new Clinton ticket- A sizable number of Obamaniacs would sit out or even jump to McCain as the more independent and non-partisan candidate (though he could blow things by getting Romney or a movement conservative as his VP).
She can not accept a #2 slot at this point in her life (although she seems to be running to be McCain's) and her campaign has exacerbated the split within the democratic party and the split has become personal at every level)(calling people like Richardson, Judas is not a good sign or either sustainability or willingness to work with with others)
NEGuy's hit it on the head. I'm very, very pro-Obama, for reasons we can get into some other time. I'm also very, very anti-Hillary. I think she embodies the worst of Bill with few of the positives. Obama as her vp would do nothing -- literally nothing -- to convince me to vote for her.
I don't want to insult you, QG, but you have too much intelligence, knowledge and character to be a valid model, notwithstanding the can't-we-all-get-along-and-if-not-we'll-shoot-you fever you claim to be suffering.
SWMBCg, etc.
"I'm very, very pro-Obama, for reasons we can get into some other time. I'm also very, very anti-Hillary."
Now that's funny. I mean, people who claim there's not a dime's worth of difference between Democrats and Republicans may overdo it, but to have a completely different take on Obama and Hillary, who are funcitonally identical, takes some doing.
Not quite fair, anonymous. QG doesn't mind statists and socialists, and he can abide the average lying politicians.
It's only that he believes, correctly, that the Clintons take it to unheard of extremes, and are dangerous to a degree your ordinary socialist isn't.
Bingo, CG! But since I'm clearly not going to get away with that teaser, I'll give the short version. I'm effectively a single-issue voter in this election: civil liberties. Obama's the only one of the three that I have any faith in whatsoever to reverse the slide our society has taken toward accepting Orwellian-worthy insults to our personal freedoms. McCain's dq'ed because of McCain-Feingold, abortion, and a few other positions he's taken. And CG perfectly expressed my view toward Hillary.
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