Monday, August 28, 2006

Everybody Must Get Stoned

Sometimes I worry that my old professor, Geoff Stone, is losing it. Rather than rationally voicing his opposition to the Bush Administration's policies, he inveighs against them as if this were some titanic, unprecedented battle over the soul of America. (I know pundits regularly talk this way, and shame on them. Academics should have more taste and intelligence.)

Look at the University of Chicago Law School's Faculty Blog for the evidence. (Stone, by the way, taugh me Evidence). Even a blog should have some standards.

On July 22nd, he declared Bush's veto of legislation authorizing federal funds for stem cell research showed "reckless disregard for the fundamental American aspiration to keep church and state separate."
...to place his own sectarian, religious belief above the convictions of a majority of the American people and a substantial majority of both the House of Representatives and the Senate? In my judgment, this is no different from the President vetoing a law providing a subsidy to pork producers because eating pork offends his religious faith. Such a veto is an unethical and illegitimate usurpation of state authority designed to impose on all of society a particular religious faith.
I'm not even gonna bother criticizing the main argument. I do want to note, however, that Stone sees fit to mention the veto was unpopular with the public and much of the House and Senate. Was there some word quota you had to fill that day, Geoff?

Now, in Stone's latest outburst, he applauds Judge Taylor's decision against Bush's surveillance program. No surprise. (Okay, maybe a little surprise, since even if you like the result, you might question the reasoning.) But Stone goes on:
I have to admit I was surprised by the decision. It takes a good deal of courage for a judge to hold unlawful a program that the President of the United States maintains is essential to the national security.
Stop, you're killing me.

Columbus Guy says: Losing it? It was unclear to me that he ever had it. But I must defer to men and women such as Posner, who will occasionally sit in the same room with him.

My favorite Stone story was during this same evidence class, when Stone visited Case Western for two weeks (maybe one) as a guest lecturer. Upon his return, he felt the need to lecture the class that, on the whole, Case students were as bright, as hard working, as interested in the material as we were.

(You could feel the hackles of 80 people rise at that moment, I'll tell you.)

In fact, Stone said, but for a college grade here, a test score, a letter of recommendation there, those students could be where we were, and we could be where they were. That was significant, he said, because, while we would have jobs essentially a year before we graduated, one-third of Case students would have jobs at the time of graduation, another one-third would find them within a year, and essentially one-third would never work as lawyers.

So, Stone concluded, whenever we meet a student from Case, it would behoove us to think to ourselves, "There but for the grace of God go I."

LAGuy took this to heart. "Whenever I see Geoff Stone," he said. "I think, 'There but for the grace of God go I.'"

LAGuy adds: There's actually more to the story, including a moment where I raised Stone's hackles. Perhaps some day I will tell it, but I'm not sure that Pajama Guy is the place for war stories.

I should add I didn't find what he said particularly insulting.

Columbus Guy says: Insulting, hell, it was insightful. But that was decidedly a minority view, as the majority found it inciteful, I'd say. Fellow grad and witness Anonymous has it right: A pompous, blustering blowhard, but an enjoyable pompous, blustering blowhard.

7 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am always amazed at those who assert that pro-lifers are "using their religious views" in politics or "mixing faith with politics".

Our entire legal system is based on the idea that persons have rights. In ways too numerous to count, the law treats human persons in ways different than how it treats cars, sidewalks, greenhouse gases, and horses.

Without this, our entire political system would have to be changed. For example, if some people had more intrinsic value than others, or some people were not recognized by the legal system if they appeared in court (the judge can, and will, ignore a parrot who tries to address the court, but all human persons are recognized as such in court).

[Many people who are non-religious, and many who are religious, support this system. In other words, they either explicitly hold or implicitly accept that human persons have certain rights that other things do not. Some of the religious people may base this concept on some religious concept -- but to the law, that's irrelevant.]

Since persons are the fundamental objects addressed by law, it is crucial that the government have some sort of policy about which objects it will deem to be "persons" and which objects it will deem to be non-persons. A horse is a non-person, and therefore the government may restrict my ability to kill a horse. But a teenager is a person, and so the government must restrict my ability to kill a teenager.

Fundamentally, the abortion debate is a debate about which objects are to be counted as legal persons. Not about which objects are human per se, but which objects are legal persons.

This is a debate that cannot be ducked. We need to either agree that a fetus is not a legal person (and thus the mother's property), or that it is a legal person (and thus killable only after due process of some sort).

This problem will get worse and worse. I may chain up a dog. If a scientist blends dog DNA with human DNA, may I enslave the resulting animal?

10:27 PM, August 27, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

(Rereading my comment I see that I didn't return to my original thesis in my conclusion -- bad writing.)

I agree that, other things being equal, it would be good for a public servant to be able to justify his choices without reference to a religion or philosophy that is not shared by everyone.

Therefore, if Stone can demonstrate that there really is a religion-neutral and philosophy-neutral criterion to answer the question of "exactly which objects are human persons", then we should all adopt his criterion.

Until he does so, no one can be faulted for using a religion, philosophy, or even a gut feeling to decide which objects are persons.

10:33 PM, August 27, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Enough about religion -- tell the one about how Geof Stone would regale his First Amendment class with-in great detail- the story(?) of the porno movies he reviewed while a Supreme Court clerk some time back in the Nixon administration. All to the end of educating us in the finer points of constitutional law (which I can't remember right now). Unfortunatelyhe was confronted by the Catherine MacKinnonites and I beleive shut down his "At The movies" routine.
A pompous blustering blowhard for sure- but always an enjoyable pompous blustering blowhard.

I count 3 U of C grads on this thread that were at the fateful Case Western speech- how many of are still practicing attorneys? Apparently God had no particular grace for me and so went I

6:47 AM, August 28, 2006  
Blogger LAGuy said...

To LK: Yes, it is surprising that Stone insists Bush's veto (which I oppose, by the way) was like forcing religion on the public. Even stranger since, I believe, Bush did not appeal to religion in explaining his vote.

If you can have ethics without religion (and you can), it's pretty easy to come up with an ethical explanation for opposing such research. Compare that with passing a law requiring everyone to keep kosher.

Even odder, if this basic level is all that's required to bring up church/state separation, then Stone's stance seems to imply that merely having your vote informed by religious belief may be impermissible. This would pretty much cut the religious out of politics.

To Anon: You can bemoan how things change, but you can't blame Stone for changing with the times.

2:38 PM, August 28, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

So, a question totally unrelated to this topic: when exactly did we replace "persons" with "people" as the plural form of "person"?

9:55 AM, August 29, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You'll find "persons" in the Constitution, especially in certain Amendments guaranteeing us basic rights, which is why it's often used in discussing these rights.

11:10 AM, August 29, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

What? Chicks aren't persons?

2:29 PM, August 29, 2006  

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